F2: Умный и глупый персонаж

[Генерал Максон]

Грубое конечно название, но отражает всю самую суть.

Навеяло, так как я тестирую RP 2.2 и мой персонаж с интеллектом 1 (просто так захотел, а то наверняка все тестеры будут играть умным персонажем).

 

Давайте поговорим о разнице (хотя все поклонники классического Fallout итак её знают, но всё же) и о том нравится ли вам играть персонажем с минимальным интеллектом. С одной стороны проще, с другой сложнее.

 

Если говорить о простоте прохождения, то, например, в Кламате можно легко пообщаться с Торром Бакнером (ведь, как известно, умный персонаж плохо понимает, что Торр ему говорит); в Город Убежища, а именно в само Убежище можно попасть и без получения гражданства (персонажу с низким интеллектом всё равно его не заслужить, про Ментат молчу), если говорить с помощником начальника таможни: он приведёт героя в Центр Распределения и того отправят работать в Убежище. В Убежище можно из центрального компьютера на 3-м уровне вынуть модуль силы.

 

Из сложностей: не все персонажи хотят говорить с глупым, из-за чего естественно он не получает около половины заданий. А если и говорят, то по большей части не все реплики, которые им доступны. Также могут легко облапошить, например, в Дыре тот бедный фермер Карл с Фермы Призраков, может сунуть руку в карман Избранному и достать половину его монет. Благо есть save/load, а то обидно ведь, копил-воровал и на тебе 

А самое главное - мало очков для распределения при получении уровня - вот это реально беда. Ещё и книжки долго читаются - по полдня наверно.

 

Лично я считаю игру низкоинтеллектуальным Избранным неплохим разнообразием для игры.

 

Может кто ещё вспомнит разные плюсы и минусы игры глупым персонажем?

 

P.S.: тема касается любой классической части Fallout.

[Мас†ер]

Ой нет, я всегда играю персом с Интеллектом 9 или 10, - потому ничем лично помочь не смогу!

[road_warrior]

Я как раз прохожу второй фолач персом с ИНТ 1. Это ураган! Диалоги просто прекрасны - "Избраный. Ты идти туда. Принести ГЕК. Ты понимать?", а в ответ можно сказать "Аыыы". Это первая игра, которая позволила мне неписю в ответ сказать "Ы" .

[Legend]

Практически все нюансы игры идиотом расписал Пер Джорнер в своих гайдах:

 

Fallout:

 

 

 

Would someone please remove this mental

abomination?

--Brotherhood Elder

 

Well, writing a stupid section isn't as exciting as for Fallout 2

since there's not much to write about. The stupid game in Fallout

basically means rushing through every area, shooting some people up for no

apparent reason and grabbing whatever loot is to be had, but not much else.

Stupid dialogues are very brief and they do not in any way connect your

character to the world in any meaningful or role-playing-like fashion.

 

Of

course there are things you can do that are relatively dialogue-independent. You

can kill people you'd normally kill, although you may miss out on quest rewards

for doing so. You can trade, although most often when you want to trade with a

shopkeeper you have to hit the barter button. And you can use objects and

skills, like when you cure Jarvis, fix the Necropolis water pump, or even use

the learning computers in Vault 13.

 

Area progression is similarly simple

to delineate: except for Vault 15 you'll get no location on your world map, with

the single exception of the Military Base from the computer in the Cathedral

vault (because that doesn't have anything to do with dialogue). As for the rest

of the places, you'll have to find them yourself. Occasionally someone will hint

at their existence (e.g. Aradesh sends you off to find Tandi, and Darrel in the

Brotherhood will tell you the Glow is to the south), but they don't light them

up on your world map. So... well, you're in for a pretty strange game if your

first Fallout character ever is a stupid one.

 

You should put

your IN at 3; you don't really need those char points for anything else and you

might want the skill points. As for skills, I found that I could get away easily

with tagging Small Guns (for use in the first third of the game or so), Melee

Weapons (using the Super Sledge in the mid-game) and Lockpick (always useful),

building Energy Weapons and using the Alien Blaster extensively during the late

game in conjunction with the Super Sledge. The only other skills I used were

Science and Repair, which I raised only with the books I found. I had no

problems whatsoever taking out the Military Base and Cathedral forces at level

13-15.

 

The only NPC you can recruit while stupid is Dogmeat. You can't

give your followers any instructions while stupid except for asking Katja to

leave. Well, it's not that different from normal NPC management.

 

You can

make your game permanently unstupid by getting the brain surgery in the

Brotherhood (if this raises your IN above 3) or by chewing Mentats and then

taking the Smooth Talker perk (if that raises your IN above 3 for speech

options). I recommend you don't do this, or indeed eat too many Mentats during

the game, since that would seem to defeat the point of playing a stupid game to

begin with. The times I took Mentats during my stupid game were:

[*]When entering the Brotherhood and picking up the Powered Armor (in theory

you could get it by going to war with the Brotherhood and raiding the

storeroom... a challenge indeed!).

[*]When getting the increased stats in the Brotherhood except for IN.

[*]When getting +2 LK from Chuck.

Also I wanted to get the +1 CH from Patrick, but I made the mistake of

talking to him while stupid, saving, eating Mentats and talking to him again,

only to discover I didn't have the dialogue options that you only get when

talking to him the first time. Oh well. Getting Bonus Rate of Fire is another

time you'd need to boost your Intelligence.

 

Here's a list of what you can

do in each location. Note that all this goes for a pure stupid game; of course

you can always use Mentats to get around a stupid limitation, so there's not

much point in noting that.

 

Vault 13: You can finish the three main

quests, but not do the local quests.

 

Shady Sands: You can go kill

the radscorpions and have Razlo make the antidote. You can get the quest to

rescue Tandi from Aradesh.

 

Vault 15: As

normal.

 

Raiders: You can free Tandi and the prisoners only by way

of normal combat.

 

Junktown: You can't do anything that requires

dialogue, but you can help Killian with the assassin, and kill Killian and/or

Gizmo. You can get Dogmeat.

 

The Hub: You can't do anything (except

free the Brotherhood initiate, for which you won't be

rewarded).

 

Necropolis: You can kill the mutants for Set, free the

prisoner, and fix the pump although you can't talk to the underground

leader.

 

Brotherhood: You can only enter by picking the door, and

you can't do anything inside except get brain surgery.

 

The Glow:

As normal, except you can't talk to Zax.

 

Boneyard: You can kill

the deathclaws for the Gun Runners (if only because of a

glitch).

 

Military Base: You can trick the guards with the Radio,

but no talking your way in or being taken to the

Lieutenant.

 

Cathedral: You can't do anything that requires

dialogue.

 

 

 

Fallout 2:

 

 

 

Ooooh! Butunz!

--The Chosen One

Playing a game with

Intelligence lower than 4 will be quite different, so I'm giving it a section of

its own. The basic difference is of course that most people won't talk to you,

or they won't give you quests, plus there's the fact that you almost never get

to use a computer. You'll notice straight away in Arroyo and Klamath that you

can't do as many things or gain as many bonuses, and as a result your character

will level up much more slowly as you progress through areas. You'll miss out on

many juicy enhancements to your character like the free Unarmed training in SF,

the combat implants, training in Arroyo and Klamath, and so on. In this way the

stupid game is not very balanced: a difference of a single char point to IN and

suddenly half of the game is taken from you. But I suppose it would have been

difficult to implement in any other way, and we should be glad it's there at

all.

 

If you're going to play a stupid game you should keep your IN at 3 -

you're getting few skill points as it is! Using the Skilled trait may seem like

a good remedy, but I say it's not worth it. The fact that you get fewer skill

points is balanced by the fact that you don't have to invest in Speech, and also

of course there aren't many skills you really need. To begin with you

should choose one combat skill and stick to that for a while at least, Small

Guns being the obvious choice since it will carry you through the entire game,

more or less. Devote early skill points to Lockpick for looting and Doctor for

convenience, put later points into Big Guns for a secondary weapon skill, and

study all those books you find.

 

You can usually do the stuff or parts of

stuff that doesn't require dialogue, e.g. you can fix Bess' leg in Modoc but not

sell her to Grisham, and you can help Charlie in Vault City with RadAway. You

get xp for finding the Raiders even though you never got that quest, and you get

xp for clearing the Redding mine even though you didn't buy the deed. Sometimes

you can "simulate" quests if you know what's needed to trigger certain

reactions, e.g. you can kill the Dragon or Lo Pan with Super Stimpaks and then

collect a reward from the other.

 

Since you level up so slowly, most big

battles will be much too difficult for you when you first come across them. For

instance, you won't be able to free Vic without killing Metzger's band of

slavers, and you couldn't possibly do that at level 3 without playing dirty.

Likewise you'll most likely have to circumvent the raiders and the wanamingos

for some time. I was able to take out Darion's gang at level 9 by using Plasma

Grenades and saving and loading a lot during combat, but only returned for the

raiders and wanamingos after I got a Gauss Rifle in San Francisco.

 

Area

progression will work roughly like this: first you go to Klamath where you can

get the location of the Den from Torr. In the Den you can get the location of

Vault City from Vic - only you'd have to kill Metzger first! Since you probably

can't, let's just head east in a random fashion. Eventually, after stumbling

across Modoc, you come to Vault City purely by chance. You don't get Gecko on

your map, but the central computer in the vault will give you the four other

towns and Vault 15 (which can also be found from NCR). Vault 13 can be found in

Vault 15, or by following the deathclaws. Next you'll have to find the Military

Base on your own, and use the Survey Map there to find San Francisco. Matthew

will put Navarro on your map and that's it.

 

In a strictly stupid game you

normally wouldn't get the car. This sucks, so what can we do about it? First, go

to Gecko and kill Skeeter for the car part (you won't have to fight the other

ghouls). Steal Lynette's Mentats while passing through Vault City. Return to the

Den with $2750 (you should have just enough) and the two car parts, eat the

Mentats, talk to Smitty and install the parts. You'll now be able to drive

around like in a normal game, at least if you're able to find or trade for

enough fuel (I had no problem with that). Note that you need Mentats again to

get the upgrades in NCR and New Reno, but you can manage without

them.

 

NPC management could be difficult. You can get a few of them

(Sulik, Vic, Goris, K-9, Dogmeat, and you can of course use Mentats to recruit

others), but you won't really be able to talk to any of them except Goris and

Dogmeat. This means, for instance, that you can't get them to put away their

weapons as you enter NCR, and you can't drop them off anywhere. Anyway, since CH

is largely wasted on a stupid character as far as dialogue in concerned, maybe

you won't be able to have many followers to begin with. It's up to you if you

want to go solo or if you need the edge in combat.

 

As you reach the last

few areas on the mainland, prepare for your game to get a little backward. In a

normal game I tend to avoid stupid shortcut techniques and instead take on each

challenge in the "proper" order armed with whatever NPCs and equipment I have at

the time. In a stupid game this may not be feasible, which leads to some weird

choices. For instance, should you invest in perks and weaponry so you could take

on the mutants at the Military Base and get the Power Armor? Or should you amass

weapons and cash so you could buy the Power Armor in SF instead? But if you're

going to do that, why not simply drive to Navarro, waltz in and pick up the

Advanced Power Armor for free? In short, the temptation to resort to stupid

shortcut techniques will increase as the linearity of the game breaks down. I

would recommend that you resist for as long as you are able.

 

For quests

and stuff there are always Mentats, which I suppose you could theoretically keep

in unlimited or at least generous supply. However, this would seem to defeat the

point of playing a stupid game to begin with. Therefore Mentats should only be

used when there is something you feel you absolutely need to do like getting the

car, getting a certain area like the Sierra Army Depot on your map, or when you

need to meet the requirements of a favourite perk like Bonus Rate of

Fire.

 

There are a few ways of increasing your IN permanently during the

game: the Gain Intelligence perk, the Yellow Memory Module, and the Hubologist

alignment in San Francisco. Naturally you should stay away from these or your

stupid game won't be stupid any more, assuming you start out at IN 3. The Smooth

Talker perk requires IN 4 to get, but once you have it it'll make you talk

unstupidly if it raises your IN above 3 for dialogue purposes.

 

Here's a

brief summary of what can be done at the various

locations:

 

Arroyo: You can kill the plants for Hakunin and let him

mix Healing Powder for you.

 

Klamath: You can kill the rat king and

protect the brahmin. You can get Sulik.

 

Toxic Caves: You need

Mentats to put it on on your world map, but you can rescue Smiley once you do

and get the Gecko Skinning perk.

 

The Den: You can lay Anna to rest

if you kill Joey for the locket. You can find Vic, but you need to kill the

slavers to get him in your party (and Vault City on your map) and you may find

it difficult to do that early on. You can become a Slaver. You can collect

Rebecca's reward for killing Metzger.

 

Modoc/Ghost Farm: You can do

the first two Slag quests, guard Grisham's brahmin and clean out Farrel's

garden.

 

Vault City: You can get the autodoc perk. You can give the

doll to Curtis. You can visit the vault and get the travel

log.

 

Gecko: You can't do anything.

 

Raiders: As

normal.

 

Broken Hills: You can arm-wrestle Francis, take the

scorpion tests, relocate the plant and recover Typhon's

treasure.

 

Redding: You can't do anything.

 

New Reno:

You can recover the car in a violent manner and go with the Wright children to

watch the desert transaction. Male characters can box. You can become a Porn

Star and paralyze Jimmy.

 

Golgotha/Stables/Sierra Army Depot: You

can't get these on your world map without Mentats. Nothing exciting going on

except for calling Marjorie Reed "Delenn".

 

NCR: You can get the

zeta scan, kill Jack for Mira, guard Westin's brahmin and do Duppo's brahmin

drive. You can also take the Vault 15 job.

 

Vault 15: You can do

everything except expose the spy.

 

Vault 13: You can do everything,

even get Goris.

 

Military Base: As normal.

 

San

Francisco: You can get the vertibird plans for the Brotherhood and get the

stat improvements afterwards, get the zeta scan, kill Ken Lee for the

Hubologists and rescue Suze.

 

Navarro: Pretty much as normal, oddly

enough. You can get K-9.

 

Enclave: You'll have to destroy the

reactor using explosives and fight Horrigan on your own, otherwise nothing

special.

 

Special encounters: You cannot talk to Arthur, otherwise

nothing special. You can get Dogmeat.

 

[GenesisVII]

Даааа,такого уже нигде не увидишь...

[Генерал Максон]

Даааа,такого уже нигде не увидишь...

Это точно. Лично меня немного разочаровало, что в Fallout 3 нет возможности поиграть тупым персонажем. На диалоги низкий интеллект там не влияет. 

[vindicator]

 Также могут легко облапошить, например, в Дыре тот бедный фермер Карл с Фермы Призраков, может сунуть руку в карман Избранному и достать половину его монет. Благо есть save/load, а то обидно ведь, копил-воровал и на тебе 

 

Ну... У Карла после того как он нажрется пойла и задрыхнет можно свои кровные назад своровать (забавно звучит: "назад своровать"... но это факт!!!). 

 

Да и вообще... что касается воровства тупицей: это "ОГОНЬ!!!". Сам таким играл... воровство - 18%, а тырил так, как при 200 - 250% . Причем были моменты при воровстве стоя лицом к лицу... 

 

Правда мой идиот был харизматичным (10) и удачливым (10). Мож. потому и везло так... а вообще - идиот - это сила... особенно прикалывали реплики в Арройо после прохождения Храма (если ты избранный, то нам точно конец ) и в Кламате (слушай, вот тебе лопатка, иди там в песочке покопайся).

 

Из сложностей - в Нью Рино, если не ошибаюсь, только одна семья идиоьу даст задания. Остальные сразу валить после диалога будут. Больше пока не вспомню... до конца так и не прошел...

[Генерал Максон]

Если очень хочется, можно принять Ментатс, чтобы стать на время поумнее, например, мне хотелось взять в команду Маркуса, и только благодаря Ментату мне удалось получить от него все задания, связанные с Брокен-Хиллс. Потом он присоединился ко мне (единственный раз я прибегнул к помощи Ментата, в виде исключения - уж очень хотел себе в команду взять Маркуса, а заодно и приказал ему с Виком держаться ближе, ведь у тупого данная опция диалога с союзниками отсутствует).

[YOBA]

Можно поробовать поиграть тупым не обязательно делая "тупой билд" в самом начале ПрИкЛюЧеНиЙ!!!!

Можно жрать 2 ментата,после когда эффект кончается у вас отбирают 2-4 "кровных" кусков мозга,после чего на короткое время можно тупить,властвовать и унижать

П.С. Еще если с низким интелектом ( там даже разные вариации кажись есть для 3,2- инт.) то можно поговорить по душам с игральным автоматом,испугатся его или просто "слышать" как он тебя заманивает ( хотя это кажется действие бухла )

[Генерал Максон]

Мне понравилось, когда он начал рыться во внутренностях главного компьютера Города Убежища, подумав, что разговаривает не компьютер, а женщина внутри железной коробки, попытался её вскрыть и пошарил в проводах, да так, что его током шандарахнуло 

[YOBA]

Вот подтверждение выше сказаному мной,а то сожгете еще на костре меня

 

{2100}{}{Вы видите странную позолоченную металлическую коробку с тремя глазами и одной рукой. Это самая красивая вещь, которую вы когда-либо видели.}

{2101}{}{Моя }

{2102}{}{ хто ты?}

{2103}{}{Моя скучать МАМА. }

{2104}{}{ скучать АРР-ЙО. Моя хоцца домой.}

{2105}{}{(Пожать ему руку)}

{2106}{}{Твоя чудной мутант.}

{2107}{}{Слава Убежищу! Слава Убежищу!}

{2108}{}{Ты водяной чип?}

{2109}{}{Пойти поискать другие блестящие штуки.}

{2110}{}{Уйти.}

{2130}{}{Странная красивая позолоченная металлическая коробка с тремя глазами и одной рукой не отвечает.}

{2131}{}{МОЯ }

{2132}{}{! ТВОЯ ОТВЕЧАТЬ МОЯ!

{2134}{}{Моя дитя Выходителя Убежища. Твоя говорить моя сейчас.}

{2151}{}{Вы хватаете руку и тепло пожимаете ее. Когда вы делаете это, раздается *бзззззз,* и коробка начинает говорить! "Пожалуйста... брось... в меня деньги."}

{2152}{}{Аййййййй! Робот! Плохо! Бежааааать!}

{2153}{}{(Уйти.)}

 

# slot machine taunts loss

# male

{2200}{}{(Вы слышите, как она смеется над вами.)}

{2201}{}{*Ха-ха-ха, почему бы тебе просто не сдаться, зайка.*}

{2202}{}{*Пусть кто-нибудь другой потянет меня за рукоятку, уступи место.*}

# any

###.Magnat.###...Added by Killap. Translated by Aliet (LevCorp-like). Done...########################

{2203}{}{(Из игрального автомата раздается тихий маниакальный смех.)}

###.Magnat.###...Original 1C translation. Need no correction...########################

{2204}{}{(Вы слышите, как игральный автомат смеется над вами.)}

{2205}{}{(Игральный автомат хихикает.)}

{2206}{}{*Давай, жалкая личность, не сдавайся*}

# female

{2207}{}{*Мне от тебя больше ничего не нужно, крошка. Почему бы тебе не сдаться?*}

{2208}{}{*Дрянь!*}

{2209}{}{*Смотри, чтобы дверь казино не дала тебе по попе, когда будешь выходить.*}

 

# slot machine taunts win

# male [3X - 1X]

{2247}{}{*Айииииии! Вот так, детка! О боже, да! Да! Да, еще! Быстрее! Сильнее! Чего ты ждешь?! Еще!*}

{2248}{}{*Вот так, детка... дергай за рукоятку... быстрее, сильнее, быстрее... ну, давай же...*}

{2249}{}{*Ну же, детка... это со всеми случается рано или поздно... попробуй еще раз... пожалуйста...*}

 

 

 

Вообще,прикольно так накачатся ментатом,после того как мозги немного завянут,погулять по городку,поговорить с окружающими,много чего встретитца тип "Уга - Буга" " Моя твоя жопаноги вбить голова" "ыг,уг,ы,ы-ы-ы" итд.

[Forest]

А где лучше сделан отыгрышь низкого интеллекта: в первом или втором Фоле?

А как насчёт модов? В каких модах это развито?

[Legend]

А где лучше сделан отыгрышь низкого интеллекта: в первом или втором Фоле?

http://www.nuclear-city.com/index.php/topic/150-umnyi-i-glupyi-personazh/?p=3854

[Forest]

Это я читал, спасибо.

Меня скорее интересовало мнение попробовавших поиграть таким вариантом.

Особенно с модами.